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phase noise of ring oscillator using spectre (Read 778 times)
Andrew Beckett
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Re: phase noise of ring oscillator using spectre
Reply #30 - Jan 04th, 2010, 8:33am
 
I agree, something looks strange in those waveforms, but I'd like to know more about how those simulations were set up. Maybe something is wrong is in the setup, maybe it's a bug. In general I don't see behaviour like those plots are showing.

Mayank, is it possible to send me a testcase showing the problem? I'll send you a personal message with my Cadence email address.

Regards,

Andrew.
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Mayank
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Re: phase noise of ring oscillator using spectre
Reply #31 - Jan 20th, 2010, 4:03am
 
Hello,
       
@ Andrew : Quote:
On one of your points, Augmented (with HB) flattens the phase noise curve below the line width frequency. Strictly this is not really anything to do with the augmented algorithm, but because we had a request that the phase noise over 0dBc should not be displayed. You can argue too that the flattened phase noise is also not physical - so perhaps this is where Pancho Hideboo's "suspicion" comes from? I've certainly discussed with R&D that we need to be very careful about displaying results which are not physical however we choose to do it.

I did some MATLAB post processing on the phase noise plot obtained from pnoise sources without augmented.
---> I clipped the plot above linewidth to Fosc / 2  and imported in matlab.
---> I extrapolated the curve using linear extrap in interp1 command of MATLAB....
---> I got a plot looking quite similar to the one shown with an augmented pnoise !!!  i am referring to the flattening below line-width...

So, do augmented pnoise option just extapolates the curve below line-width freq. ?  

Of course, these flattened values do not have any correlation, whatsoever, with actual pnoise values in the region below line-width. I think we can include a disclaimer for this in the cadence documentation.  :D

@ everyone : The phase noise near the carrier frequency is almost Gaussian, instead of Lorentzian. I dont know, but i honestly wanna ask, is it that tough to model this gaussian noise in simulators that it has yet not been implemented successfully in any simulator till date ??

--
Mayank.
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pancho_hideboo
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Re: phase noise of ring oscillator using spectre
Reply #32 - Jan 20th, 2010, 5:11am
 
Mayank wrote on Jan 20th, 2010, 4:03am:
So, do augmented pnoise option just extapolates the curve below line-width freq. ?
How does Cadence Spectre determine this "linewidth" ?
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