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analog circuits synthesis tools (Read 14169 times)
koma
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analog circuits synthesis tools
Jan 04th, 2011, 1:49pm
 
dear all,

I am new to the tools used for analog circuit design so I have some questions regarding the capabilities of the tools and the best tools to use.
in digital design I used to write an RTL code in verilog, synthesize it to generate a a gate level netlist file...i just wanna ask if we have the same procedure in analog circuits design..I started looking for verilog AMS which allows me to write the behavioral model for a certain analog block but am worried if i can take this code to generate a transistor level circuit with certain transistor sizes or synthesize it and do place and route .
I have access to cadence tools that i am using to write my verilog ams code.

regards,
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Andrew Beckett
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Re: analog circuits synthesis tools
Reply #1 - Jan 5th, 2011, 5:30am
 
See http://www.designers-guide.org/Forum/YaBB.pl?num=1165836451/2#2.

Whilst various synthesis tools have been created for specific classes of circuits, there aren't really any good general solutions. Years ago I wrote (along with some colleagues) a switch capacitor filter synthesis tool, which worked pretty well - but it was targeted at one specific type of circuit.

So normally it needs a designer to "synthesize" the design from a high level spec (or model) to transistor level (of course, you may be able to build the design from existing blocks such as opamps, data converters, comparators, etc).

The closest approach that has been reasonably successful is using optimization to size the design once the topology has been developed. This is mainly beneficial in terms of design centering and yield improvement though (and relies on you capturing the appropriate measurements and specifications to ensure that the optimizer is sufficiently well constrained).

Regards,

Andrew.
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koma
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Re: analog circuits synthesis tools
Reply #2 - Jan 5th, 2011, 11:19am
 
thanks for the reply,
it seems i am missed with the procedure that I should follow...for example I have an ADC module written in verilog AMS what are the next steps I should follow to end up with a schematic or transistor level netlist...I know it is a simple question but can you advise me regarding that.
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Andrew Beckett
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Re: analog circuits synthesis tools
Reply #3 - Jan 5th, 2011, 1:19pm
 
You need to hand craft the design. There's no push button to convert from a behavioural model to a transistor level design.

You should read some books on Analog Design to get a good idea of the process.

Best Regards,

Andrew.
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koma
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Re: analog circuits synthesis tools
Reply #4 - Jan 5th, 2011, 1:42pm
 
actually am familiar with the hand calculation and transistor level design procedure for basic analog components like opamp..but I thought there is an easier way that I can follow to design a larger analog blocks by just providing the functionality.

but can I understand from your last post that there is no equivalent procedure that can be followed in analog similar to the digital one(RTL(behavioral model)-->synthesis-->gate level(structural model))

regards,
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loose-electron
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Re: analog circuits synthesis tools
Reply #5 - Jan 30th, 2011, 5:46pm
 
Many attempts have been made to do automated analog design. Except for extremely limited cases of specific circuits, all have failed.

Going from RTL Verilog to a digital synchronous chip has largely been automated.

Not the case for analog design. If you have not done analog design it is time to go back to school in this area to become familiar with the issues involved.

Doing a Verilog AMS model of a converter is fairly straightforward, but gettting the design functional at the transistor level is orders of magnitude more complex.

Adding to the confusion, some of the tools that were developed to do automated analog design failed to recognize many of the variables that were important in making the design viable. One company burned huge amounts of venture capital with an outcome that allowed the automated design of op-amps. However, they were fixed in architecture, and the results were neither size or power optimized.

Not sure when computers are going to make this are obsolete, but its not on the horizon as of yet. The changing parameters associated with CMOS geometry changes has made the process even more difficult. Techniques to optimize become a moving target.
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Jerry Twomey
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Re: analog circuits synthesis tools
Reply #6 - Mar 4th, 2011, 8:33am
 
loose-electron wrote on Jan 30th, 2011, 5:46pm:
One company burned huge amounts of venture capital with an outcome that allowed the automated design of op-amps. However, they were fixed in architecture, and the results were neither size or power optimized.



Was this company named after a city in Spain?
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Re: analog circuits synthesis tools
Reply #7 - Dec 13th, 2011, 5:55pm
 
barcelona design
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loose-electron
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Re: analog circuits synthesis tools
Reply #8 - Dec 18th, 2011, 5:18pm
 
in the last 20 years there have actual been a number of them who have tried and failed.

Never say never, but probably not in the next 10 years.
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Jerry Twomey
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