The Designer's Guide Community
Forum
Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register. Please follow the Forum guidelines.
Apr 27th, 2024, 10:54pm
Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
PAC simulation on OTA with SC CMFB (Read 3202 times)
petitidiot
New Member
*
Offline



Posts: 8

PAC simulation on OTA with SC CMFB
Oct 29th, 2014, 7:42pm
 
Dear guys,
I have been confused by a problem for a long time.
I have a fully differential OTA with switched capacitor common mode feedback. I want to find the dc gain. The first way is to run ac simulation with flying capacitors having initial conditions. The simulation result is 64dB, which is the same with the sc cmfb replaced by ideal ct cmfb. However, if i run the pac, the dc gain is only 46dB. The gm is 1uS.  The flying cap is 100fF. The clk is 20KHz. I use alternative network to settle the output, so the effective switch cap resistor may read 1/2fC = 250M. The calculated gain is near the pac simulation result. The textbook said that the switch cap may provide loading to the output impedance. I am not sure does it also counts for the resistive loading? As such, which simulation, ac or pac, reflects the real situation?
Thanks!
Back to top
 
 
View Profile   IP Logged
Ken Kundert
Global Moderator
*****
Offline



Posts: 2384
Silicon Valley
Re: PAC simulation on OTA with SC CMFB
Reply #1 - Oct 29th, 2014, 11:21pm
 
How did you measure DC gain?
Back to top
 
 
View Profile WWW   IP Logged
petitidiot
New Member
*
Offline



Posts: 8

Re: PAC simulation on OTA with SC CMFB
Reply #2 - Oct 30th, 2014, 12:34am
 
Dear Kundert,
When I measured the DC gain, first I ran a short transient and recorded the transient differential voltage over the switch capacitors. Then I put that value in the initial conditions of those caps and ran an AC analysis. By this means, I could get the result the same with ideal continuous time cmfb. However, I could get this DC gain by PAC. I am not sure if the resistve loading effect of sc has to be taken into consideration.
Back to top
 
 
View Profile   IP Logged
Ken Kundert
Global Moderator
*****
Offline



Posts: 2384
Silicon Valley
Re: PAC simulation on OTA with SC CMFB
Reply #3 - Oct 30th, 2014, 2:36am
 
The most accurate approach would probably be to use pstb analysis to compute the openloop gain and extract the DC value. And you should do so in the actual circuit where the amplifier will be operating. I do not recommend using AC analysis. It is forcing you to make unnecessary assumptions and approximations.

-Ken
Back to top
 
 
View Profile WWW   IP Logged
Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
Copyright 2002-2024 Designer’s Guide Consulting, Inc. Designer’s Guide® is a registered trademark of Designer’s Guide Consulting, Inc. All rights reserved. Send comments or questions to editor@designers-guide.org. Consider submitting a paper or model.